Chatbox log - 2010-11-01 - Zelaron Gaming Forum

[14:17] !King_Amazon!: So either he'll do nothing about it, which makes him seem like he's all bark but no bite (and the GOP will call him on that a lot, I'm sure) or he will act and lose a lot of his supporters

[14:17] !King_Amazon!: He probably isn't incredibly thrilled about the situation. It would be hard for it to end well for him

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[15:04] System: D3V has joined the chat

[15:04] D3V: I hope it pressures him into acting. I think Rahm Emanuel leaving his cabinent is the best thing to happen until this prop 19 situation.

[15:05] System: !King_Amazon! has joined the chat

[15:05] !King_Amazon!: Pressures him into acting how?

[15:06] !King_Amazon!: I highly doubt he will just change his previous statements against recreational use and suddenly be for it

[15:07] D3V: well he was for legalization before he was against it.

[15:07] D3V: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQr9ezr8UeA

[15:07] !King_Amazon!: For recreational use?

[15:07] D3V: *decriminalization

[15:07] !King_Amazon!: right

[15:08] !King_Amazon!: But he has stated that he will not allow legalized recreational use

[15:08] D3V: I think he's sly about what he says. Politically speaking, in terms of strategy, he would like to get the ball rolling aka not letting feds raid clinics, which allows momentum for a bill like this to pop up.

[15:08] !King_Amazon!: So either he will have to act against legalization, or sit passively

[15:08] !King_Amazon!: Right but that is in regards to medical use

[15:08] D3V: he's just covering his ass. I guarantee he would sit passively.

[15:09] !King_Amazon!: Passivity isn't really a better move for him, though

[15:09] !King_Amazon!: That's what I mean, either move is bad for him

[15:09] D3V: right, it is but that's what he's good at.

[15:09] !King_Amazon!: If he does nothing, republicans will call him a flip-flopper or say he doesn't stick to his word

[15:09] D3V: making bad situations into slightly less bad situations.

[15:09] D3V: yeah, but they're going to do that regardless.

[15:10] !King_Amazon!: This would pretty much give them a valid example, though

[15:10] !King_Amazon!: Like I said, he has openly stated he will not allow legalization for recreational use

[15:10] !King_Amazon!: If he doesn't stick to his word, he will lose credibility

[15:10] D3V: yeah but it's not his decision

[15:11] D3V: he can say he won't support it. but ultimately the decision falls on the rest of our lawmakers

[15:11] !King_Amazon!: It is his decision whether or not to send federal agents into California to stop recreational use

[15:11] D3V: I know what you're saying, and I agree with it. I just think he's being strategically smart about how he says it and what he says.

[15:11] !King_Amazon!: No, smart would have been saying "I support legalization" from the start

[15:12] D3V: not politically.

[15:12] !King_Amazon!: Tap dancing around the truth because of political implications just makes him look like a jackass, IMO

[15:12] D3V: right, which is what politicans do. which is what he's done since he got into office lol.

[15:13] D3V: he doesn't want any more possible negativity. like I said, he's gonna let this ride its course and go from there. Even when it does pass nothin will change.

[15:13] !King_Amazon!: So because that has come to be known as the norm, we should just accept it as "that's how things are" and not care that he's basically lying about how he feels?

[15:13] !King_Amazon!: I'd rather him say what he thinks and be unpopular than try to make everything look great to everyonwe

[15:13] !King_Amazon!: That is where I think Biden is more qualified than Obama

[15:14] !King_Amazon!: At least Biden says whatever the fuck he wants without regard for who is listening or anything

[15:14] D3V: Dude, I agree with you 100%. I wish he could say what he wants to. There are so many pressures surrounding him than either one of us could even comprehend.

[15:14] D3V: Yeah, but Biden might have a tourettes moment with the "launch codes" for example. I think he's actually a bit of a security risk with how sloppy he is when he speaks.

[15:14] !King_Amazon!: The only way to change that is to speak out against it

[15:15] D3V: true.

[15:15] D3V: and that's what Obama campaigned on.

[15:15] !King_Amazon!: And now he's showing that that was BS, IMO

[15:15] !King_Amazon!: He's playing the game just the same as anyone else because he doesn't want to lose popularity for his opinions

[15:15] D3V: I think if Prop 19 passes, there won't be any worry about his dealings with federal agents

[15:16] !King_Amazon!: It's frustrating when that is all politicians do these days

[15:16] !King_Amazon!: I hope not

[15:16] D3V: right, he wants to hang around for a consecutive presidency term.

[15:16] !King_Amazon!: I think he's smarter than that, but I dunno

[15:16] D3V: wouldn't you? I think he's still smarter than the people he's surrounded by.

[15:17] !King_Amazon!: I wouldn't compromise my integrity to further my political aspirations, no.

[15:17] D3V: then you would never get elected to begin with, IMO

[15:17] !King_Amazon!: And I'd vote for a politician that speaks his mind over a politician that says what people want to hear any day of the week

[15:17] D3V: lol. it's a double-edge type situation.

[15:17] !King_Amazon!: Maybe not, but that is only because the system is in place

[15:17] !King_Amazon!: And the only way to change it is to speak out against it

[15:17] !King_Amazon!: We need more politicians to stand up and say what they think

[15:18] D3V: right, like congressman Alan Grayson of orlando.

[15:18] !King_Amazon!: Exactly

[15:18] D3V: I wish he would run for President, i'm not sure if you've heard of him or not.

[15:18] !King_Amazon!: I have, and I agree

[15:18] !King_Amazon!: He is what politicians should be, IMO

[15:18] D3V: he comes off as a dick sometimes, but he's what should be

[15:18] D3V: yea

[15:18] !King_Amazon!: Our congress is so much like a puppet show these days

[15:19] D3V: right. they're controlled by money. which is my biggest arguing point ever.

[15:19] !King_Amazon!: I thought it was funny when people got mad at Colbert for addressing congress in character

[15:19] D3V: remove corporate influence from politics and the problem is solved.

[15:19] !King_Amazon!: Because 99% of the people in congress are "in character" every fucking day

[15:19] D3V: agreed

[15:19] !King_Amazon!: We really need one of the parties to implode

[15:19] !King_Amazon!: At this point, I don't even care which one

[15:20] D3V: right.

[15:20] !King_Amazon!: I'm almost certain a third party would win if either the dems or repubs disappeared

[15:20] !King_Amazon!: That's probably the only way the game will really change, at this point

[15:21] D3V: oh absolutely. That's why i'm going to vote for Christ for governor of our wonderful sunshine state. At this point, it really could go either way. The Democrats are pussies and don't stand up for what they believe in, and the Republicans are mainly batshit insane and express the most extreme views of their party most of the time. It's the worst of both worlds.

[15:22] D3V: and while we sit here between the two parties and argue about pointless shit like abortion, welfare and immigration they're staying in power, keeping the same cronies in charge of Congress, electing the same puppets to keep the show on for another 20-30-40 years and the people that keep losing are the average american.

[15:22] !King_Amazon!: I suspect that if Obama does end up acting against recreational marijuana, Ron Paul will attempt to exploit that fact

[15:22] !King_Amazon!: I'd probably vote for him, too.

[15:22] D3V: is Ron Paul running again?

[15:23] !King_Amazon!: I dunno

[15:23] !King_Amazon!: http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp201...aware-s230.png

[15:23] !King_Amazon!: How the hell does that batshiat insane woman have so much support?

[15:23] D3V: Ron Paul is old as fuck, he's older than Mccain I think. Maybe we need an age cap for presidents so they don't keel over.

[15:24] D3V: because she's a semi-attractive female, soccer mom type who brought up masturbation.

[15:24] D3V: and no black-democrat is going to vote for anyone named 'coon', im sorry.

[15:24] !King_Amazon!: haha

[15:25] D3V: I think she might actually be more stupid than sarah palin, i've seen her on TV a few times and it's just jaw-dropping that she's even remotely relevant.

[15:25] !King_Amazon!: I think we should make it where a candidate cannot spend more money than they would make in their term were they to be elected

[15:25] !King_Amazon!: I think it's stupid that people spend 10-100x more money than they will make in office to get into office

[15:25] !King_Amazon!: It screams corruption to me

[15:25] !King_Amazon!: Why else would they do it?

[15:25] D3V: i like that proposition

[15:26] D3V: why would they vote against that? they'd pis on that bill if it were to show up on their desks.

[15:26] D3V: why would they vote against how things are*

[15:26] !King_Amazon!: Christine O-donnell is definitely more stupid than Palin, which is kinda amazing

[15:26] D3V: right, never thought that day could come amirite

[15:26] !King_Amazon!: I don't think Palin is as stupid as she seems, though

[15:26] !King_Amazon!: She sure knows how to manipulate people

[15:27] D3V: right, she's pretty good at it.

[15:27] D3V: I mean she got to be a governor before any of us heard of her.

[15:27] D3V: I guess that dont'cha know good looks mustve worked

[15:27] !King_Amazon!: haha

[15:27] !King_Amazon!: yeah

[15:28] D3V: maybe we need to run for office. What party? I guess it doesn't matter. Just say outrageous shit as our platform and find some extremists to support us.

[15:28] !King_Amazon!: And now she's doing a reality show, lol

[15:28] D3V: right she knows how to work it and I can applaud that.

[15:28] D3V: even if she did come pretty close to endangering our entire country and electoral process

[15:28] !King_Amazon!: I couldn't even imagine if she were our vice president right now

[15:29] !King_Amazon!: It would just blow my mind

[15:29] D3V: her and McCain? we'd probably be in Iran by now.

[15:29] D3V: things could be much worse. In Iran, we wouldn't have had a stimulus so the economy potentially couldve gotten worse.

[15:29] !King_Amazon!: Shit, she would have killed McCain, taken the presidency, and invaded Russia by now most likely

[15:30] D3V: lol.

[15:30] D3V: sigh

[15:30] D3V: i'm just going to move to Canada

[15:31] !King_Amazon!: I used to say that but I think the derp is spreading :(

[15:31] D3V: lol

[15:31] D3V: so I guess plan B is to take the country back huh

[15:32] !King_Amazon!: Jamer is already on it

[15:32] D3V: ya?

[15:32] !King_Amazon!: http://zelaron.com/forum/group.php?groupid=28

[15:33] D3V: i love jamer

[15:34] !King_Amazon!: agreed

[15:34] !King_Amazon!: So do you think Prop 19 will pass?

[15:35] D3V: I do, that's with a lot of hope factored in.

[15:35] !King_Amazon!: The polls don't necessarily look good, but there's supposedly an explanation for it

[15:35] !King_Amazon!: "Significant discrepancies in polls have revealed what may be a flaw in polling companies' methodology when conducting interviews for Proposition 19. Due to a "social desirability bias" many people, especially minorities, have tended to deny their support for Proposition 19 especially when polls are conducted by a live interviewer, but, when polled by an automated interviewer, more respondents have been inclined to acknowledge their support for Proposition 19."

[15:36] !King_Amazon!: "EMC Research did a poll, paid for by the advocacy group Yes on 19, using both live and automated interviewers to show the difference between the two types of polling. Their live interviewer poll showed significantly less support (40% for, 45% against), than their automated poll (56% for, 41% against)."

[15:36] D3V: hmmmmmmm yeah that sounds weird.

[15:36] D3V: I think there is also a lot of misinformation floating around about what Prop 19 actually is.

[15:36] !King_Amazon!: Misinformation is one of the biggest problems with our world today :(

[15:37] D3V: yeah it definitely makes me a sad panda because I have faith in people in general but the fact they are lied to changes the equation. its like jr high girls run the world or something.

[15:38] !King_Amazon!: Pretty much

[15:38] !King_Amazon!: A lot of the problem is that we are just too big for our own good

[15:38] !King_Amazon!: There's so MUCH information that the misinformation tags along for the ride without any trouble

[15:38] D3V: right with the vast availability of information lies the same with misinformation

[15:39] !King_Amazon!: And people don't bother fact checking, which is retarded

[15:39] D3V: right they take whatever google search, facebook update, myspace message as fact and run with it.

[15:40] D3V: i'll admit I do it too, I think we're just brought up in lazy times.

[15:40] D3V: everyone just expects everything to be given to them.

[15:41] !King_Amazon!: What gets me is chain mails and shit like that

[15:41] !King_Amazon!: I just cannot comprehend taking something to be fact just because someone forwarded it to me and 20 other people

[15:41] !King_Amazon!: It's incredibly dangerous.

[15:42] !King_Amazon!: "Another discrepancy, based on type of phone, was noted on the Action News/SurveyUSA poll taken on November 1, 2010. Those interviewed via landlines opposed the initiative 53% to 43%, while those on cell phones supported it almost 2 to 1.[42] This could be because younger voters, who overwhelmingly support the initiative in nearly all polls taken to date, are more likely to have cell phones than landlines. Several polls may thus be biased towards "No" as a result."

[15:42] !King_Amazon!: More on the prop 19 polls

[15:42] D3V: right. people ACTUALLY think they can get bad luck for 7 years if they don't pass it on. but seriously, during the 2008 campaign the muslim shit about Obama is a prime example.

[15:42] !King_Amazon!: yeah

[15:43] D3V: right, most 18-25 year olds live in apartments/dorms and dont have landlines

[15:43] !King_Amazon!: I'm guessing Prop 19 passes with 50-60% in favor

[15:43] D3V: so what do people like you and me who generally agree on the problems the rest of the country have?

[15:43] !King_Amazon!: I doubt it will be an overwhelming win, though

[15:43] D3V: that would be good enough for me.

[15:44] D3V: see the thing about CALI is theyve been on the medicinal bandwagon since the early 90's I think the vote might be higher like 70-30

[15:44] !King_Amazon!: maybe

[15:44] !King_Amazon!: They claim a lot of the growers are against it, which kinda makes sense

[15:44] !King_Amazon!: The price will be driven down without the black market

[15:45] !King_Amazon!: They will make less money

[15:45] D3V: yeah but screw them.

[15:45] !King_Amazon!: Not only that, but it is likely big corporations will take over the industry

[15:45] !King_Amazon!: IMO they need to have it set up like wine country though

[15:45] !King_Amazon!: I'd rather have stuff grown by a small grower than shit grown en masse by some big corporation

[15:45] D3V: right. But, I might not be able to make my own whiskey or moonshine, but I can grow a plant. And so can the people in Cali.

[15:46] !King_Amazon!: Up to 25 square feet!

[15:46] D3V: right I think small coffee shops will still have a variety

[15:46] D3V: what a deal. that's a mini-forest.

[15:46] D3V: so do you think the entire country being stoned vs the entire country being sober which is better?

[15:46] D3V: for one day.

[15:46] !King_Amazon!: Honestly, I don't think things will change much.

[15:47] !King_Amazon!: But I'd rather everyone be stnoed

[15:47] !King_Amazon!: stoned

[15:47] !King_Amazon!: By my estimates, 25 square feet is anywhere from 15-25 plants

[15:47] D3V: I wonder how much $ could be made in revenue per year if every state was legalized.

[15:47] !King_Amazon!: I've never grown so I don't know for sure, though

[15:48] !King_Amazon!: You could make a 25' long row which is 1' deep and it would be 25 square feet

[15:48] D3V: weed plants are weird, they need a lot of light, but can still grow good together in bunches.

[15:48] !King_Amazon!: I would guess you could fit a plant in 1 square foot

[15:48] D3V: yeah 15-20 plants is proabbly about right. but if you keep them trimmed they expand sideways.

[15:48] D3V: yeah.

[15:48] !King_Amazon!: I don't know if sideways expansion would be a bad thing :P

[15:49] D3V: and if you can use grow lights that problem is eliminated

[15:50] !King_Amazon!: I hope if they mass produce the stuff they don't do it mexischwag style

[15:50] !King_Amazon!: That will probably be the main benefit of small growers and growing for yourself

[15:50] D3V: rofl not watering it for days letting it cure too long. it's really not that hard of a process but when its left in baggies/non sealed jars it loses its potency.

[15:50] !King_Amazon!: Also, the growers in Cali already know how to make primo product

[15:51] D3V: i can tell you firsthand that homegrown regs is just as good as any cryp youll ever get.

[15:51] D3V: right.

[15:51] !King_Amazon!: I wouldn't be surprised if some of the big corps hired on some growers

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